Installed Transfer Switch in House

[HammaMan]

This isn’t specifically directed at you, but I don't understand folks who drop $70k on a truck and then spend a bunch of time trying to save a few hundred bucks on the interlock vs transfer switch.

Cuz ya don't need one and you still have to go run the cord / hook it up. Throwing the main and sliding up an interlock takes less time than typing this out and I type pretty quick.

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[Kodiak]

thanks!

Since a transfer switch/wiring that works for most generators doesn’t seem to be compatible with the PB, I didn’t know if the setup that works for the PB also works on most generators (since it seemed to be PB specific).

The Generac 6852 is not Powerboost specific, it is bonded neutral specific. Many old gas generators were not bonded neutral but I think the trend for newer ones it to go with bonded neutral (BN). The PB happens to also be BN.

I had an old style transfer switch (sub panel) that would take any old type floating neutral generator except BN. It was quite old and I used it with a Troybuilt 7000 gas generator. However it would not work with the BN because of the inability to separate the house BN to the truck (generator) BN. This is what causes the truck to trigger the fault. In fact you can find many vids on Youtube with people showing you how to defeat the small gas BN generator and switch it to Floating Neutral or defeating the gas generator neutral altogether. Not with the PB though.

The Generac has a built in switch that separates the neutral automatically. Most just plain run of the mill sub panels do not. That is what makes the Generac (or perhaps a couple others) unique to run a BN generator.

HammaMan has a thread that shows you how to make a "dogbone" extension where you cut the neutral in the 30 amp 4 prong dogbone so you can use the PB on any transfer switch but if you search the threads you will see a lot of arguments against this. You must make it yourself as you will not find one of these on Amazon since they may/may not be code. It is cheaper but not code is the argument. You do you.

Consider the Generac just a "step up" in the sub panel transfer switch department that will let you run the PB (BN) without issue or chance of backfeed. Good luck with your decision.

 

[HammaMan]

The Generac 6852 is not Powerboost specific, it is bonded neutral specific. Many old gas generators were not bonded neutral but I think the trend for newer ones it to go with bonded neutral (BN). The PB happens to also be BN.

I had an old style transfer switch (sub panel) that would take any old type floating neutral generator except BN. It was quite old and I used it with a Troybuilt 7000 gas generator. However it would not work with the BN because of the inability to separate the house BN to the truck (generator) BN. This is what causes the truck to trigger the fault. In fact you can find many vids on Youtube with people showing you how to defeat the small gas BN generator and switch it to Floating Neutral or defeating the gas generator neutral altogether. Not with the PB though.

The Generac has a built in switch that separates the neutral automatically. Most just plain run of the mill sub panels do not. That is what makes the Generac (or perhaps a couple others) unique to run a BN generator.

HammaMan has a thread that shows you how to make a "dogbone" extension where you cut the neutral in the 30 amp 4 prong dogbone so you can use the PB on any transfer switch but if you search the threads you will see a lot of arguments against this. You must make it yourself as you will not find one of these on Amazon since they may/may not be code. It is cheaper but not code is the argument. You do you.

Consider the Generac just a "step up" in the sub panel transfer switch department that will let you run the PB (BN) without issue or chance of backfeed. Good luck with your decision.

All portable generators with metal frames are bonded -- there are some portable plastic ones that don't bond but also don't have metal frames / are all plastic. MOST generators out there are bonded, and to correctly feed a structure need 3 wire xfer switch or bond undone, which nobody does.

As I say, 2 things can both be true, the PB's dogbone connection that breaks ground continuity is both not to code, and safe to operate. When done in this manner, if you're only feeding the structure all is well. If you decided to plug into one of the truck's outlets an appliance / tool (3 prong using grounding conductor (2 prong tools are double insulated)), you lose the GFI protection on the device plugged into the truck's outlet (sounds like a big deal, but if you're backfeeding the house you have no reason to plug something into the truck's outlets, doesn't apply if you're using it in-cab) -- essentially it'd be like plugging into an outlet in the house that's not GFI protected which is just about every bedroom / hallway outlet. Very niche case, not important if you're just feeding the structure as the structure's GFI circuits like you'd find in the garage / kitchen / laundry still work as they do on utility derived power. I don't typically mention it because the goal is to back feed the structure, not plug in other devices to the truck while powering the home.

You start going into such detail and it just confuses people. If you use the floating ground dogbone approach, the only thing plugged into the truck should be your generator plug. Any shorts to the truck are protected. Of if you want to sit in the cab and use the outlets while in the truck (not to be confused with an extension cord running outside of the truck, that's the same as plugging into the bed) GFI is working. Inside of the truck, the truck is your 'earth grounding plane' -- outside of the truck w/ the dogbone, the structures grounding system makes the earth your ground plane.

 

[YouHaveJamesWoods]

Thanks! I think you got to the root of my question - I should have focused more on the wiring of the transfer switch being compatible both the PB and Lightning, as well as something like the harbor freight inverter generators like the below one. I’d rather not store and maintain a separate generator if I don’t have to. It’d just be great to know that I’m not wiring my transfer switch to solely work with the PB.

https://www.harborfreight.com/9500-...enerator-with-co-secure-technology-59188.html

 

[wyoming]

All portable generators with metal frames are bonded -- there are some portable plastic ones that don't bond but also don't have metal frames / are all plastic. MOST generators out there are bonded, and to correctly feed a structure need 3 wire xfer switch or bond undone, which nobody does.

As I say, 2 things can both be true, the PB's dogbone connection that breaks ground continuity is both not to code, and safe to operate. When done in this manner, if you're only feeding the structure all is well. If you decided to plug into one of the truck's outlets an appliance / tool (3 prong using grounding conductor (2 prong tools are double insulated)), you lose the GFI protection on the device plugged into the truck's outlet (sounds like a big deal, but if you're backfeeding the house you have no reason to plug something into the truck's outlets, doesn't apply if you're using it in-cab) -- essentially it'd be like plugging into an outlet in the house that's not GFI protected which is just about every bedroom / hallway outlet. Very niche case, not important if you're just feeding the structure as the structure's GFI circuits like you'd find in the garage / kitchen / laundry still work as they do on utility derived power. I don't typically mention it because the goal is to back feed the structure, not plug in other devices to the truck while powering the home.

You start going into such detail and it just confuses people. If you use the floating ground dogbone approach, the only thing plugged into the truck should be your generator plug. Any shorts to the truck are protected. Of if you want to sit in the cab and use the outlets while in the truck (not to be confused with an extension cord running outside of the truck, that's the same as plugging into the bed) GFI is working. Inside of the truck, the truck is your 'earth grounding plane' -- outside of the truck w/ the dogbone, the structures grounding system makes the earth your ground plane.

I managed to get ahold of a Generlink MA23-S (https://www.globalpowerproducts.com/transfer-switches/generlink-transfer-switch/) from a buddy of mine (Transmission line electrical engineer turned master electrician and business owner) for no cost. The power company approves this as a meter mounted device and they mounted it to my house today.

When I explained to him the PB’s generator setup and the ground removal, he agreed with your statement above: Does it meet code, no. But does it provide any risk to those within the house (my biggest concern), also no.

The Generlink takes a special plug at the unit itself, so he is still waiting for that to come in, but I am planning to follow your ‘dogbone’ suggestion for the final connection to the truck.

Is there anything I’m missing here for this to be functional?

 

[HammaMan]

I managed to get ahold of a Generlink MA23-S (https://www.globalpowerproducts.com/transfer-switches/generlink-transfer-switch/) from a buddy of mine (Transmission line electrical engineer turned master electrician and business owner) for no cost. The power company approves this as a meter mounted device and they mounted it to my house today.

When I explained to him the PB’s generator setup and the ground removal, he agreed with your statement above: Does it meet code, no. But does it provide any risk to those within the house (my biggest concern), also no.

The Generlink takes a special plug at the unit itself, so he is still waiting for that to come in, but I am planning to follow your ‘dogbone’ suggestion for the final connection to the truck.

Is there anything I’m missing here for this to be functional?

Looks like it has a specific adapter on it? Didn't see it in the literature for it. Looked at the one w/ surge and they're $1,200!?

 

[Hullguy]

The modified dog bone methods is a shitty way to work around the legal, safe way to use the Powerboost as an emergency generator source. You lose your grounding system!

 

[wyoming]

Looks like it has a specific adapter on it? Didn't see it in the literature for it. Looked at the one w/ surge and they're $1,200!?

Yes this is the switch end plug. They are crazy expensive retail. But the product itself is pretty convenient. No electrician, no separate panel, etc.

 

[HammaMan]

The modified dog bone methods is a shitty way to work around the legal, safe way to use the Powerboost as an emergency generator source. You lose your grounding system!

You don't lose the grounding system

 

[Tigmd99]

Is it me or are people just making things more complicated by trying different routes when a clear path is available?

 

[Pierre.Granger]

Is it me or are people just making things more complicated by trying different routes when a clear path is available?

Amen. I had a certified electrician install a code compliant Generac transfer switch. It works. Enough said.

 

[Pierre.Granger]

 

[Tigmd99]

Amen. I had a certified electrician install a code compliant Generac transfer switch. It works. Enough said.

Spend it once and it is good for a lifetime…….and now that i have a secondary generator, the Generac works with that too. So it will outlast my Ford!

 

[Hullguy]

You don't lose the grounding system

Prove it!!!

 

[Hullguy]

Is it me or are people just making things more complicated by trying different routes when a clear path is available?

Agreed! The only National Electrical Code installation method is a neutral switching transfer switch!

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