ECU module programming guide using FDRS

[rugedraw]

I've wondered for a while now about the beta ability to program modules. It seems pretty clear that no one here uses it for "normal" module updates, but is that because it's not possible or just because it's really not a good idea? In other words, can it theoretically be used to get our trucks all updated without going to FDRS? And if the answer to that question is "yes", can it also do that using the regular Forscan adapters like the vLinker?

I'm not about to try updating my modules with it anytime soon, just wondering why no one around here ever seems to say much about that possibility.

No, this is not recommended for various reasons; most of which go beyond the knowledge I have of how these things work. You use FDRS for updates, and you use FORScan for fixes or experiments that FDRS does not allow you to do.

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[JEB]

I've wondered for a while now about the beta ability to program modules. It seems pretty clear that no one here uses it for "normal" module updates, but is that because it's not possible or just because it's really not a good idea? In other words, can it theoretically be used to get our trucks all updated without going to FDRS? And if the answer to that question is "yes", can it also do that using the regular Forscan adapters like the vLinker?

I'm not about to try updating my modules with it anytime soon, just wondering why no one around here ever seems to say much about that possibility.

I agree with @rugedraw . I absolutely will NOT use FORScan Beta for routine updates for three reasons. (1) It’s dangerous. Even the FORScan folks have strongly recommended against using Beta in this manner. (2) Access to calibration and software files is not straightforward. You generally have to ask around to get everything you need. (3) FORScan Beta cannot handle APIM updates—perhaps the single most important update for most users.

 

[Dave79]

I absolutely will NOT use FORScan Beta for routine updates for three reasons.

To restate - I'm not planning to or suggesting anyone else should. I was just curious if it was even possible. It sounds like it is, but no one does it for the aforementioned reasons.

 

[JEB]

To restate - I'm not planning to or suggesting anyone else should. I was just curious if it was even possible. It sounds like it is, but no one does it for the aforementioned reasons.

You can’t use it at all for the APIM. It’s not possible.

 

[Snakebitten]

Besides, to use Forscan, you'd have to harvest the necessary files first anyway. Unless you have FDRS, or you have FDRS logs for every potential F150 trim/build.....

Point being, FDRS is just easier for obvious reasons.

The gurus have a LOT of records/data to afford their methods.

 

[rugedraw]

To restate - I'm not planning to or suggesting anyone else should. I was just curious if it was even possible. It sounds like it is, but no one does it for the aforementioned reasons.

Not calling you out at all......but here is a perfect example of why not to try to update a module with FORScan:

https://www.f150lightningforum.com/...-connect-cannot-fix-looking-for-advice.23768/

This guy just turned his Lightning into a 3-ton paperweight earlier today.

 

[superfordman]

Update! Well I apparently cried wolf a little early, got out on the highway this morning where it was clear, no snow, and clearly defined lines, and LC engaged! Not sure if it just took a good 24-48 hours for everything to clear or the snow was just really messing with it that much, but worked just fine all day 100+ miles on clear roads! It must be much more sensitive to engage now as it seems to take a bit longer in some cases. I haven't seen that warning message again and that is new with this software. Count my lucky I guess..

FORScan Beta is a life saver.
I know you know more about this kind of stuff than the average person. If you feel up to the task, I can get you the files for ACJ so you call roll yourself back. Or reach out to Jesse and he can help you out. It takes three hours to flash just like updating it does, but all he would have to do is remote in to get it going.

Thanks man, luckily I reached out to @m_bt54 yesterday and he got me the missing files I needed to backdate. Luckily I held off and gave it another chance today versus burning 3 hours to go back to what I already had.

Agreed, Jesse helped me this time last year backdate the ACM/DSP due to the chime issue only through IPC issue.

 

[Jesse-Infotainment]

FORScan Beta is a life saver.



I know you know more about this kind of stuff than the average person. If you feel up to the task, I can get you the files for ACJ so you call roll yourself back. Or reach out to Jesse and he can help you out. It takes three hours to flash just like updating it does, but all he would have to do is remote in to get it going.

He can do it.. he needs the files.. hes very good also.

 

[Jesse-Infotainment]

I know there are smart people on here.. I tried EVERYTHIGN I could think of to make the new version work.. @m_bt54 was willing to try anything we did.

We even rolled the gateway to a version that i know worked with the new one.

As far as patterns.. the issue exists with trucks that have the P series gateway software.. it happens with the R series gateway.

I have looked at trucks like Livnitup who has the new version working on his power boost.. and cant find anything that stands out to me.

When the only thing you do is change firmware and it works that tells you something. Not one as build change made between the two.

Ive always fixed the wonky weird stuff like the wrench light after the PCM update. The TCU Country code.. and many others. this one must have a conflict somewhere. I cant see it. We tried different PSCM software.

The F10a and F16B are the same between ACJ and BBC.. all other files for BBC are the same amongst all trucks.

So its a real mystery..

 

[m_bt54]

I know there are smart people on here.. I tried EVERYTHIGN I could think of to make the new version work.. @m_bt54 was willing to try anything we did.

We even rolled the gateway to a version that i know worked with the new one.

As far as patterns.. the issue exists with trucks that have the P series gateway software.. it happens with the R series gateway.

I have looked at trucks like Livnitup who has the new version working on his power boost.. and cant find anything that stands out to me.

When the only thing you do is change firmware and it works that tells you something. Not one as build change made between the two.

Ive always fixed the wonky weird stuff like the wrench light after the PCM update. The TCU Country code.. and many others. this one must have a conflict somewhere. I cant see it. We tried different PSCM software.

The F10a and F16B are the same between ACJ and BBC.. all other files for BBC are the same amongst all trucks.

So its a real mystery..

I greatly appreciate all the time you spent trying to figure this one out, especially where the timeframe was literally Thanksgiving- New Years! I was always good with the rollback option, especially where there doesn’t seem to be much difference between the newest IPMA and the last but was really hoping we’d find a better/ easier solution as the number of impacted trucks started to and continues to grow. Hopefully Ford can figure this one out for the next release. I wouldn’t want to be the guy who isn’t on this forum and shows up at the dealership with this issue.

 

[superfordman]

So did some more driving today and LC still seemed to have troubles kicking in and discovered something new with this latest BBC software... your seat belt needs to be buckled for LC to engage. That is definitely a new change as any version prior hasn't had that requirement. Going down the highway as soon as I clicked it in, LC engaged. Then if I took it off, LC would stay engaged until it kicked out for any reason, but then wouldn't re-engaged until the belt was clicked in again.

@m_bt54 did you have you seatbelt on when trying to run LC?
@rugedraw same for any of the other guys having the same issue?

I have my belt minder disabled but that is it. I wonder then if some guys that go even deeper and disable the seat sensor and/or seat belt monitoring completely, if that causes issues as the IPMA can't see those anymore so will never engaged LC since it can't monitor them?

 

[m_bt54]

So did some more driving today and LC still seemed to have troubles kicking in and discovered something new with this latest BBC software... your seat belt needs to be buckled for LC to engage. That is definitely a new change as any version prior hasn't had that requirement. Going down the highway as soon as I clicked it in, LC engaged. Then if I took it off, LC would stay engaged until it kicked out for any reason, but then wouldn't re-engaged until the belt was clicked in again.

@m_bt54 did you have you seatbelt on when trying to run LC?
@rugedraw same for any of the other guys having the same issue?

I have my belt minder disabled but that is it. I wonder then if some guys that go even deeper and disable the seat sensor and/or seat belt monitoring completely, if that causes issues as the IPMA can't see those anymore so will never engaged LC since it can't monitor them?

Did you get any alert on screen or otherwise telling you to wear your seatbelt??

BC did work for me two random times during all my issues but it never made sense why.


@Jesse-Infotainment I don’t wear my seatbelt and have the alert disabled with forscan. Any chance you think this might be something? Some impacted mentioned never making forscan changes

 

[superfordman]

Did you get any alert on screen or otherwise telling you to wear your seatbelt??

BC did work for me two random times during all my issues but it never made sense why.


@Jesse-Infotainment I don’t wear my seatbelt and have the alert disabled with forscan. Any chance you think this might be something? Some impacted umentioned never making forscan changes

No, just the "LC not available" when it wanted to engage warning but my belt wasn't on.

I almost wonder/bet 99% if that wasn't your issue then. I just have the alert/belt minder disabled in the same way so never says anything to me, but that is just the alert so it still knows in the background if you have it on or not.

 

[m_bt54]

So did some more driving today and LC still seemed to have troubles kicking in and discovered something new with this latest BBC software... your seat belt needs to be buckled for LC to engage. That is definitely a new change as any version prior hasn't had that requirement. Going down the highway as soon as I clicked it in, LC engaged. Then if I took it off, LC would stay engaged until it kicked out for any reason, but then wouldn't re-engaged until the belt was clicked in again.

@m_bt54 did you have you seatbelt on when trying to run LC?
@rugedraw same for any of the other guys having the same issue?

I have my belt minder disabled but that is it. I wonder then if some guys that go even deeper and disable the seat sensor and/or seat belt monitoring completely, if that causes issues as the IPMA can't see those anymore so will never engaged LC since it can't monitor them?

No, just the "LC not available" when it wanted to engage warning but my belt wasn't on.

I almost wonder/bet 99% if that wasn't your issue then. I just have the alert/belt minder disabled in the same way so never says anything to me, but that is just the alert so it still knows in the background if you have it on or not.

I’m not against updating again and trying it with and without my seatbelt if anyone thinks it is worthwhile. I also have a couple fake seatbelts I can plug in to disable that way without the truck knowing

 

[superfordman]

I’m not against updating again and trying it with and without my seatbelt if anyone thinks it is worthwhile. I also have a couple fake seatbelts I can plug in to disable that way without the truck knowing

Worth a shot if you got the time, but I have a pretty good feeling. I'll do some playing now and see if you totally nuke the seat belt and/or seat occupancy sensors, if the IPMA can't compute that then so LC/BC never engages period since it can never detect either, but mine are all still enabled. As long as your clicked in however you see fit, it should be happy.

Some software release notes for stuff like this would be nice @Ford Motor Company... oh right, you aren't creeping on us anymore ?

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