Powerboost 7.2kW Powering House - Which transfer switch works best?

[Samson16]

Bond the PB frame to the ground counterpoise. Problem solved ?

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[Hullguy]

NEC uses a catch-all approach. Over 30k house fires a year occur with NEC compliance. Given the number of house fires that are NEC compliant, it's easy to mix cause and effect. It's a great set of base rules, but it's not a magic safety as has been drilled into you.

Im a professional who tries to exceed the requirements of the NEC. Many of those legally binding requirements were put in place to keep people who do stupid things like running extension cords under rugs. Which is why AFCI came into being. Gif is came into being for added protection for shocks between plumbing and electricity.
25000 of those electrical fires are caused by portable electric heaters, not the wiring installed under the NEC!

Every transformer bonds N/G. GFI can't see a double bond, only when current flows and it sees a delta between what's leaving/returning on the sum of L1, L2, and neutral will it trip. The PB won't trip on a 2 pole switch if all the energy leaving it is feeding 240v circuits. A trip will only occur when 120v is used and redundant N/G return paths return energy on both conductors due to 'missing' current on the neutral as a result of parallel return paths, and only when the ground is allowed to return > 5ma of current. If 2 120v devices of equal current are connected to separate legs, even that isn't enough to trip the GFI with dual bonding. That's nearly impossible to achieve, but still won't trip it if the 2 loads are completely identical.

Agreed. I try not to get people bogged down in theory.

There is a clear way to avoid tripping the GFI. It doesn't eliminate the ground wire, it creates 2 separate grounding planes. A short between any 2 hots or the neutral will result in an instant trip for the PB's breaker as it's far more sensitive than any panel circuit breaker tripping at 32 amps with no delay. The PB's breaker will trip before a 20 amp and 15 amp panel breakers will. All GFI and AFI breakers in the structure continue to function as they should. I think you should spend time going deep into grounding / earthing and how/why they came about. It'd provide you with significantly deeper insight into what's going on here. Utility derived hot phases are trying to return to earth due to ubiquitous neutral earth bonding throughout the system. The PB's L1 and L2 are trying to return to it, not the earth. Failing to acknowledge this doesn't make it any less true.

Prove your theory! Show me how, if you cut the ground pin off a dogbone, you have not eliminated the dwellings ground path? It’s impossible!
I should spend time going deep into grounding and earthing? 37 years of working and studying this isn’t deep enough?

 

[Hullguy]

Bond the PB frame to the ground counterpoise. Problem solved ?

Only have drive 4 ground rods to make a counterpoise!??‍

 

[MLH]

We are getting the rain from the hurricane here in western Virginia. The power is out and we can hear our only neighbor’s generator running about 200 yards away but they can’t hear our Powerboost truck running. In fact we can’t even hear it running. We have all the house running. This is why we bought this truck oh and don’t forget 430 HP and 23 MPH. NICE.

 

[KevinSr1]

We are getting the rain from the hurricane here in western Virginia. The power is out and we can hear our only neighbor’s generator running about 200 yards away but they can’t hear our Powerboost truck running. In fact we can’t even hear it running. We have all the house running. This is why we bought this truck oh and don’t forget 430 HP and 23 MPH. NICE.

Used mine during last hurricane. I’m on west coast of Florida just north of Tampa. Power was out for 7 hours. Truck powered 2 refrigerators, 2 fans, and 2 lamps. Awesome and quiet. Love this truck!

 

[capkmo]

I wanted to provide an update on the Interlock install
I did go this route vs the transfer switch upon heavy recommendation from my electrician. To make it work, he disconnected the ground wire from the outlet before installation so the cable will not be grounded when plugged in allowing the truck and home to both utilize their own grounds
I am able to run everything in my home off the truck (furnace, fridge, microwave, etc) with the exception of the clothes dryer and 100 gallon hot water heater
I'm super happy with this setup and happy to answer any questions you all might have

 

[Gros Ventre]

I wanted to provide an update on the Interlock install
I did go this route vs the transfer switch upon heavy recommendation from my electrician. To make it work, he disconnected the ground wire from the outlet before installation so the cable will not be grounded when plugged in allowing the truck and home to both utilize their own grounds
I am able to run everything in my home off the truck (furnace, fridge, microwave, etc) with the exception of the clothes dryer and 100 gallon hot water heater
I'm super happy with this setup and happy to answer any questions you all might have

This arrangement has been presented in a video much earlier among the posts. In essence a ground path is actually available with this setup. What I don't get is that a full up panel with a switchable neutral isn't available. Except for the hot water heater, clothes dryer and oven, the total load in a single family residence is around 7-800 watts. If you have a well pump that'll take another 800 watts or so. The Powerboost could run one of those three larger loads at a time (each around 4 kW), so you'd have to switch them out. A panel with limited outlets is just a non-starter to my way of thinking. I find it interesting that a certified electrician recommended this.

 

[capkmo]

This arrangement has been presented in a video much earlier among the posts. I essence a ground path is actually available with this setup. What I don't get is that a full up panel with a switchable neutral isn't available. Except for the hot water heater, clothes dryer and oven, the total load in a single family residence is around 7-800 watts. If you have a well pump that'll take another 800 watts or so. The Powerboost could run one of those three larger loads at a time (each around 4 kW), so you'd have to switch them out. A panel with limited outlets is just a non-starter to my way of thinking. I find it interesting that a certified electrician recommended this.

I did see the video but wasn't quite sure what I was looking at as my electrical knowledge is limited. This makes sense though
When you say "a panel with limited outlets is a non-starter" doesn't this interlock provide more flexibility than a manual transfer switch would? I definitely need to head into the garage to flip breakers if I want one of the higher output items to work but this seems overall more flexible?
My house was built in 2020 and was at about 400 watts when tested, no well pump and mainly natural gas appliances

I'm certainly not trying to debate as I know little about electrical setups but I'm curious your thoughts

 

[Gros Ventre]

I did see the video but wasn't quite sure what I was looking at as my electrical knowledge is limited. This makes sense though
When you say "a panel with limited outlets is a non-starter" doesn't this interlock provide more flexibility than a manual transfer switch would? I definitely need to head into the garage to flip breakers if I want one of the higher output items to work but this seems overall more flexible?
My house was built in 2020 and was at about 400 watts when tested, no well pump and mainly natural gas appliances

I'm certainly not trying to debate as I know little about electrical setups but I'm curious your thoughts

A "manual transfer switch" is a switch with a switched neutral. "Emergency panels" seem to have a switched neutral but something like only 8 breaker slots and are commonly manual. You are required to have an interlock feature to prevent back powering the external grid (and shocking a worker out there). In my case I have an interlock (on Square D they must be in the upper right slots) on my input breaker.

 

[BobbyG]

A "manual transfer switch" is a switch with a switched neutral. "Emergency panels" seem to have a switched neutral but something like only 8 breaker slots and are commonly manual. You are required to have an interlock feature to prevent back powering the external grid (and shocking a worker out there). In my case I have an interlock (on Square D they must be in the upper right slots) on my input breaker.

My Generac transfer switch came with 8 breaker slots but my electrician switched to split minis and fit in 12 circuits plus one AC and it's air handling unit. We have power in every room except dining, have 2 refrigerators and 1 freezer, cooking, heating and hot water are gas. That said, I originally had the interlock but we couldn't make it work over the ground issue. Live and learn.

 

[Gros Ventre]

The issue that I have is that a typical single family house only needs three or four large capacity circuits: Water heater, Dryer, A/C (if you have one), oven, & Electric baseboard heaters (if you have these). The rest of the house including a refrigerator, two freezers, a well pump, and other items only takes at most 1 kW... a panel that limits you to 8 slots is just nuts. Why don't the major electric panel makers like Square D make such a panel with 30 or 40 slots?

 

[Pierre.Granger]

I wanted to give an update since I have replaced my model year 21 Limited with a model year 24 platinum plus. First thing I did in the driveway is plug in the new truck and flip the Generac to test house power. I ran it for a half hour no issues. The Generac powered The PTAC unit in my mother’s room, Power in almost all the rooms, a refrigerator and a freezer and also powered my washer and dryer. Essentially everything but my main HVAC Unit. No issues whatsoever Generac eight Breakers were plenty.

 

[powerboatr]

I f your utility allows this
It's a transfer switch at the meter base
It allows you to run any load in the house, as long as you don't exceed wattage limits
We don't have a pb..but it works with portables as well as other sources
And it's removable if you sell your house..
It's just one more option thst utilities are allowing these days..
Food for thought
Always use a licensed knowledgeable electrician.
My power company installs it for 25 bucks. And they sign off on its installation

 

[awardnasc]

Does anyone have a recommendation for an outdoor rated 3-pole manual transfer switch? My main panel is on the back of the house and it would be difficult to run all of the wires for the standard generac 6854 solution mounted indoors to back there.

It looks like reliance used to make an outdoor 3 pole transfer switch but from what I can tell they have discontinued it. Edit: I spoke with reliance and they are targeting Q4 2025 to have a neutral switching transfer switch.

 

[Gros Ventre]

What I'd like to see is a full up panel for a house with the neutral switching feature. A normal single family residence only uses maybe 1 kW outside of an oven, dryer, hotwater heater, & maybe baseboard electric heat. Those will call for load management if you don't have a 15-20kW generator. Run one at a time the house uses maybe 6 or 7kW. So a full up panel would be really nice.

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