A Difference in Gasoline Brands

[Pcabe5]

Just like oil, it's all about additives

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[dochawk]

No one tests gasoline at the pumps for anything other than validates octane and that the amount pumped is accurately

???

What kind of backwards state do you live in? In most states it could be either the Attorney General , or whatever they call the Board of Equalization, and possibly more. And by "or" I mean that any of these could do it.

Not to mention Cadillac, Mercedes, Toyota, and so forth, who have just as expensive of lawyers as the petroleum countries, and would be more than mildly angry about footing the bill for the repairs caused by gas that didn't have the advertised detergents!

There are no standards for additives

except for, well, Top Tier. That's *exactly* what Top Tier is.

and any petroleum company would consider any additive to be a trade secret and kept from any government agency.

likely true. But this standard did not come from the petroleum industry, nor from any of its members. It comes from the engine manufacturers, who need to know what's coming through the injectors and into the high compression cylinders. Gasoline vendors can either meet the requirements and certify that, or not.

 

[amschind]

I think that the one real difference is EtOH free vs EtOH polluted gasoline. Sadly, I think that ethanol is now the chief octane enhancer, so EtOH free is 87 or 89 octane unless you shell out for race gas (i.e. not a practical solution for road driving). I don't have a problem with ethanol in a vacuum; in fact, I would happily tune for and run E85 if I could get it reliably. My issue is with gas which contains just enough ethanol to absorb water over time but not enough to boost octane. I realize that the ethanol in E10 IS boosting octane, BUT it is only doing so to a level which could be achieved with additives which do not reduce energy density or absorb water from the air. Either give me 103 octane and a 33% energy density hit with the assumption that 5% of my gas is water OR give me 93 octane with gasoline's energy density and no water. 93 octane and an energy density hit and water absorption is the worst of all worlds for everyone but corn farmers.

 

[Samson16]

???

What kind of backwards state do you live in? In most states it could be either the Attorney General , or whatever they call the Board of Equalization, and possibly more. And by "or" I mean that any of these could do it.

Not to mention Cadillac, Mercedes, Toyota, and so forth, who have just as expensive of lawyers as the petroleum countries, and would be more than mildly angry about footing the bill for the repairs caused by gas that didn't have the advertised detergents!



except for, well, Top Tier. That's *exactly* what Top Tier is.



likely true. But this standard did not come from the petroleum industry, nor from any of its members. It comes from the engine manufacturers, who need to know what's coming through the injectors and into the high compression cylinders. Gasoline vendors can either meet the requirements and certify that, or not.

He lives in California and never responds to posts. ?

 

[Samson16]

93 octane and an energy density hit and water absorption is the worst of all worlds for everyone but corn farmers.

Isn’t 87 with 10% ethanol the “worst of all worlds”?

 

[ks54703]

Live within 3 miles of a Fuel Tank farm that supplies our area. Any day of the week one can see all of the different brands of fuel tankers loading up. As a local IBEW electrician by trade worked in this very same tank farm and their is no SPECIAL tanks for each brand of fuel they all get filled from the same tanks through the same hoses in the exact same style.

 

[fmdog44]

Moonshiners used their booze when all else fails. The modern term for this is "multitasking".

 

[amschind]

Isn’t 87 with 10% ethanol the “worst of all worlds”?

Arguably yes, but I'm giving 87 E10-15 credit for at least being the cheapest option. I'm putting 93 octane E10-15 at the bottom because you're paying too dollar for an inferior product.

 

[Samson16]

Arguably yes, but I'm giving 87 E10-15 credit for at least being the cheapest option. I'm putting 93 octane E10-15 at the bottom because you're paying too dollar for an inferior product.

It’s certainly painful as I choose to pay $0.79 more per gallon for Shell’s 93 premium over the 87. I’ve just always ran premium in my turbocharged and high compression NA vehicles. I consider it when making the purchase.

 

[SonarChief]

Live within 3 miles of a Fuel Tank farm that supplies our area. Any day of the week one can see all of the different brands of fuel tankers loading up. As a local IBEW electrician by trade worked in this very same tank farm and their is no SPECIAL tanks for each brand of fuel they all get filled from the same tanks through the same hoses in the exact same style.

From a fuel truck driver who got a little closer…


“ Virtually all additives that go into any fuel, as specified by the retailer, is done at the fuel terminal when the tanker is loaded. I used to haul fuels. It is interesting to swipe a card that lays out the specs for the end retailer, then watch various lights go on with different tanks as they inject additive into the stream being loaded in to the truck tanker. There might be an occasional outlet that does its own fuel dosing, but that is not the norm.”

Not sure how we got on this tangent of conspiracy theory’s when the original question was whether fuel additives matter, and whether purchasing a gas brand that has a legally binding minimum of said additives is worth the added cost. The answer probably lies in whether the vehicle is a long term investment, or just a 3 year rental.

 

[HammaMan]

“ Virtually all additives that go into any fuel, as specified by the retailer, is done at the fuel terminal when the tanker is loaded. I used to haul fuels. It is interesting to swipe a card that lays out the specs for the end retailer, then watch various lights go on with different tanks as they inject additive into the stream being loaded in to the truck tanker. There might be an occasional outlet that does its own fuel dosing, but that is not the norm.”

Their cards are what gets them into the terminal. The driver then enters the details of the fuel to be received at the computers telling it which arms he's using, the fuel type desired, and the quantity to be dispensed. Along with this information is who he is, his trailer number, the customer, etc... Once fueling commences the arm will add to the base gasoline relevant additives as its going into the tanker itself. You can watch the process in full detail on several driver's YT pages. The only one I've seen with specific arms for branded premium are shell loads.

Here's 1 of 5 part series of going to various racks fueling the tanker

 

[jamo13]

Yes: there will be a label announcing it, like/l

There are other possible locations, too.

I regularly use the Top Tier "Station Finder" when traveling to new locations. However, I have found some gas station locations listed didn't have the the "Top Tier" sticker on any of the pumps. Make's me wonder if it is an "Independent vs Franchise" thing (i.e., certain national brand stations can choose not to use "Top Tier" based on what type of contract they have or their location). It might also be due to the fact that most of these stations I have visited seem to have older looking pumps, are out in rural/small population areas or the owners/attendants were just too lazy to put the sticker on.

 

[fmdog44]

All milk comes from the same cow, the farmers spike it as they choose much like booze.

 

[dochawk]

All milk comes from the same cow, the farmers spike it as they choose much like booze.

That's silly. Everyone knows that you need a brown cow for chocolate milk!

And then there's the plainsmen who ferment it into kvass . . .

 

[fordtruckman2003]

There are no standards for additives and any petroleum company would consider any additive to be a trade secret and kept from any government agency.

All additives need to be registered with their chemical composition.
The list goes beyond just pump additives.

https://www3.epa.gov/otaq/fuels1/ffars/web-gas.htm

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