I could use some advice from towing experts.

[Aron]

I am a newbie on this topic, but trying to learn from all the folks here myself. You are seeing that you have your wife and yourself weighing in at only 300# right? and nothing for luggage, items in bed, hitch, etc., etc.? Here's mine, and it drastically changes the math from yours...One question for anyone - how does a weight distribution hitch change anything here? or does it? I thought with one I could have a much higher tongue weight?

Weight distribution hitches don't allow for towing heavier hitch loads (despite what trailer salesmen might tell you); they are basically just a huge "wrench" to add a twist (a "moment" in engineering terms) to the tongue to help correct the "V" that would naturally form from adding a huge weight to the rear of the truck.

Without a WDH, putting hundreds of pounds of weight on the rear bumper will force the truck rear to squat and the front to lift (like a seesaw). Without the WDH, this will likely overload the rear axle, while raising the front axle high enough that it may even cause steering issues. The WDH adds a bending force to straighten the truck back out, which has the cumulative effect of "moving" weight from the rear axle to the front truck axle and the trailer axle(s). The weight is still there; it's just being supported by other axles.

Further, the hard limits of the truck hitch point remain--even if you distribute the weight to all axles, you can only stress that hitch point so far. My truck says that it has a max hitch weight of 1400lb with a WDH and 500lb without one (you have to crawl under the truck to see it).

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[Aron]

I've not made any decisions but am thinking about Sumo Springs.

Should help with roll a little, without sacrificing daily ride and is a simple bolt on process.

I would recommend towing without modifications first, to see where you might need some help. Every gadget you add is going to take a hit on payload, and that's ultimately the limiting factor for most powerboosts.

For what it's worth, I haven't noticed much roll while towing.

 

[Davexxxx]

I would recommend towing without modifications first,

Yes, thats the plan but I like having a plan B.

 

[Nasto]

I am a newbie on this topic, but trying to learn from all the folks here myself. You are seeing that you have your wife and yourself weighing in at only 300# right? and nothing for luggage, items in bed, hitch, etc., etc.? Here's mine, and it drastically changes the math from yours...One question for anyone - how does a weight distribution hitch change anything here? or does it? I thought with one I could have a much higher tongue weight?

Well, silly me. I never saw the Configure button. I originally changed the Added Weight to 400 for 2 passengers, 500 lbs for Cargo and 100 lbs for Accessories and plugged that total number in manually. Now I'm using the configure button and it spit out this. Math is fun.

 

[Davexxxx]

Well, silly me. I never saw the Configure button. I originally changed the Added Weight to 400 for 2 passengers, 500 lbs for Cargo and 100 lbs for Accessories and plugged that total number in manually. Now I'm using the configure button and it spit out this. Math is fun.

So you see what we were all getting at.

You'll have to shift truck cargo to the mid or rear of the trailer to get anything like a usable tongue weight, while keeping at least a 10% tongue weight.

You can do it. It'll just take some tinkering, trial and error and a few trips to the CAT scales.

Your 1288 payload takes whatever room you thought you had.

 

[FordPrefect]

We have a '23 Powerboost Max Tow, 5.5 foot bed, with a Winnebago Minnie that weighs 6,000lb dry.

Compared to running an F-250 with a diesel, for example, this is a compromise in one significant way, I think. I manage the cargo capacity problem with great care because it would be easy to go over. For example, I've chosen a very light tonneau and tow with the truck bed and trailer holding tanks empty, pay scrupulous attention to tongue weight, and weigh the whole mess whenever I change things much. To help with squat, I've fitted an Anderson WDH and a Roadactive Suspension kit. Thanks to the many folks on this forum who share info regularly about these things - I am quite happy with the results.

Of course with a 3/4 ton diesel I probably wouldn't have to think about any of that, but I think the OP could take some confidence away from our experience.

Compared to an Airstream, the Minnie is a flying brick. You know you're towing it whenever the wind comes up, but I've never encountered a handling problem that could not be managed by simply slowing down a bit.

We recently took that rig up to Ruidoso from Las Cruces. The route involves a long straight shot through the White Sands Missile Range where the speed limit is 75, but since I have a nervous passenger (and am towing a flying brick), I just set the cruise control at 65. Being passed by an occasional tractor trailer is a new one on me, but my wife says she's happier with the way I drive when we're towing, than when we're not.

Just past Tularosa there's a pretty steep climb that peaks at about 7500 feet. I was extremely pleased with the Powerboost, both uphill and down. It easily ran at the speed limit, and while you can tell it is working harder, it isn't in any way failing to perform. Clearly there is plenty more power there if needed - I can't imagine a hill I'd be willing to tow this trailer up that the Powerboost couldn't handle just fine. Sure, the mileage sucks but at least gas is cheaper and I don't have to deal with DEF. The 31 gallon tank provides plenty of range.

I am looking forward to some boondocking. The Balloon Fiesta in October is a good example. We'll be in the VIP lot which means off-grid, but with ProPower onboard we have a trivial way to recharge the trailer battery every day and run the A/C if needed.

Then there's the other shoe - when we go to San Diego soon to get out of this heat again, we're leaving the trailer at home and going Airbnb. I'll be driving an F150 hybrid, not a diesel Super Duty, through the streets of La Jolla and I'll get well over 20MPG all the way there and back.

Everything's a compromise. I like what I have right now. Nope - nobody could sell me a diesel at this point. I think we'd have to acquire a taste for a much bigger trailer first, and the truck would be largely dedicated to that.

 

[Aron]

You'll have to shift truck cargo to the mid or rear of the trailer to get anything like a usable tongue weight, while keeping at least a 10% tongue weight.

You're absolutely correct, but be real careful with this, though. It's MUCH safer to be over payload than it is to get the trailer balance wrong. If you over-weight the front of the trailer and exceed your payload, the worst that will likely happen is that you prematurely wear out some truck parts, or maybe break something. If you underweight the front of the trailer too much, it could cause unrecoverable trailer sway, which can be deadly.



What I've ended up doing is taking a hard look at everything we carry, to just try to cut weight. We don't carry any water in the tanks, for example. Even when "dry" camping, I'll bring a couple of those blue 5gal water containers with us, and just go fill them up when needed (after we've unhitched).

 

[Davexxxx]

We have a '23 Powerboost Max Tow, 5.5 foot bed, with a Winnebago Minnie that weighs 6,000lb dry.

Compared to running an F-250 with a diesel, for example, this is a compromise in one significant way, I think. I manage the cargo capacity problem with great care because it would be easy to go over. For example, I've chosen a very light tonneau and tow with the truck bed and trailer holding tanks empty, pay scrupulous attention to tongue weight, and weigh the whole mess whenever I change things much. To help with squat, I've fitted an Anderson WDH and a Roadactive Suspension kit. Thanks to the many folks on this forum who share info regularly about these things - I am quite happy with the results.

Of course with a 3/4 ton diesel I probably wouldn't have to think about any of that, but I think the OP could take some confidence away from our experience.

Compared to an Airstream, the Minnie is a flying brick. You know you're towing it whenever the wind comes up, but I've never encountered a handling problem that could not be managed by simply slowing down a bit.

We recently took that rig up to Ruidoso from Las Cruces. The route involves a long straight shot through the White Sands Missile Range where the speed limit is 75, but since I have a nervous passenger (and am towing a flying brick), I just set the cruise control at 65. Being passed by an occasional tractor trailer is a new one on me, but my wife says she's happier with the way I drive when we're towing, than when we're not.

Just past Tularosa there's a pretty steep climb that peaks at about 7500 feet. I was extremely pleased with the Powerboost, both uphill and down. It easily ran at the speed limit, and while you can tell it is working harder, it isn't in any way failing to perform. Clearly there is plenty more power there if needed - I can't imagine a hill I'd be willing to tow this trailer up that the Powerboost couldn't handle just fine. Sure, the mileage sucks but at least gas is cheaper and I don't have to deal with DEF. The 31 gallon tank provides plenty of range.

I am looking forward to some boondocking. The Balloon Fiesta in October is a good example. We'll be in the VIP lot which means off-grid, but with ProPower onboard we have a trivial way to recharge the trailer battery every day and run the A/C if needed.

Then there's the other shoe - when we go to San Diego soon to get out of this heat again, we're leaving the trailer at home and going Airbnb. I'll be driving an F150 hybrid, not a diesel Super Duty, through the streets of La Jolla and I'll get well over 20MPG all the way there and back.

Everything's a compromise. I like what I have right now. Nope - nobody could sell me a diesel at this point. I think we'd have to acquire a taste for a much bigger trailer first, and the truck be largely dedicated to that.

Exactly my thoughts as well.

The PB produces strong, diesel like numbers re HP and lb.ft. In excess of small and mid sized diesels of just some few yrs. ago, without the stink, noise, extra cost and DEF.

And for daily driving, the footprint is far superior to a super duty.

Yes, they take more weight management but if you're careful with your order, workable payloads are achievable.

 

[Northguy]

You're absolutely correct, but be real careful with this, though. It's MUCH safer to be over payload than it is to get the trailer balance wrong. If you over-weight the front of the trailer and exceed your payload, the worst that will likely happen is that you prematurely wear out some truck parts, or maybe break something. If you underweight the front of the trailer too much, it could cause unrecoverable trailer sway, which can be deadly.



What I've ended up doing is taking a hard look at everything we carry, to just try to cut weight. We don't carry any water in the tanks, for example. Even when "dry" camping, I'll bring a couple of those blue 5gal water containers with us, and just go fill them up when needed (after we've unhitched).

Totally agree with this. Need to understand your trailer. You can get yourself in a very unsafe position if in trying to get weight off the truck hitch point you can end up with weight in even a worse spot. In loading my trailer I try to add weight from axle forward despite that adding more weight to the hitch point. Just find that with my trailer this minimizes propensity for the trailer to sway.

 

[{tpc}]

A couple of observations. First, TW of 500 does seem a little light, however the pictures of the airstream in this thread (forgive me if its not yours or the same one) don't show that there is a pass through storage up front. In fact, where ever the storage may be should be considered, because if its all in the back or middle over the axles, and there is nothing up front, maybe that TW is more correct than one thinks.

Second, I disagree with the notion that you will amass so much stuff that your weights will be egregiously different from a stock weight. Sure they will be different and it is to be noted. I have most of my storage in the front passthrough which is huge on my trailer and under the bed in the front. Is it heavier than the day I got it? Sure. maybe 300 lbs on the tongue if that, even if I have clothes in the bedroom. Is that alot? I guess, but I haven't added 1000's of pounds of stuff to the trailer since I got it. I mean are people putting full size home sofas in there? Motorcycles strapped to front? I just don't understand why everyone's "stuff" weighs so much.

Last, truck payload does some a little light. TLDR, but is that 1288 number based on payload minus people and "stuff" in the truck or is that on the sticker in the door jamb?

To go along with what I have already said, airstreams seem to be made a little different. No slides? Not a ton of storage for "stuff"? I feel like with what I would put in one, that it wouldn't change things all that much. But also means I'm using the truck more, and thats where payload comes into play.

For my trailer, I take my wife and I in the truck, maybe some snacks. My "sewer box" goes in the bed and thats it. So besides us, I maybe have another 50 lbs in the truck. Everything else is in the trailer. But I have a big pass through, and plenty of other storage area through out. Trailer is roughly 7k, with about 900 TW. Pulls great, I have not pulled super high long grades (that I know of). Last trip was michigan to custer sd, 7th gear the whole way, trans and engine temp never moved off the center point the entire way. Granted thats flat for 95% of the way, I doubt coming down from rapid city through hill city to custer and vice versa offered any severe grade. Truck never had any issue.

 

[Davexxxx]

You're absolutely correct, but be real careful with this, though. It's MUCH safer to be over payload than it is to get the trailer balance wrong. If you over-weight the front of the trailer and exceed your payload, the worst that will likely happen is that you prematurely wear out some truck parts, or maybe break something. If you underweight the front of the trailer too much, it could cause unrecoverable trailer sway, which can be deadly.



What I've ended up doing is taking a hard look at everything we carry, to just try to cut weight. We don't carry any water in the tanks, for example. Even when "dry" camping, I'll bring a couple of those blue 5gal water containers with us, and just go fill them up when needed (after we've unhitched).

I just received my WeighSafe Middleweight hitch the other day.

Having that scale right there, will make things so easy in seeing the immediate impact and being able to adjust placement.

I bought a new digital scale and will know all significant weights of gear as they are added. (I plan on a significant solar / battery / inverter system).

I honestly don't expect any surprises when I hit the Cat scales for confirmation.

 

[powerboatr]

Excellent points. Thank you! To answer your question, the Airstream "Unit Base Weight", as they refer to it is 5,000 lbs. Net carrying capacity is 1,000 lbs. So GVWR is 6,000 lbs. This particular model has a dual axle.

one thousand pounds of payload will evaporate like a grape sitting the hot sun
water, propane etc
so the truck will become the CARRIER of all the stuff


so good that your planning and lookign forward
nothing sucks more than being overweight

 

[hitekguruaz]

Tool from Ford takes the guess work out of towing numbers.

https://www.ford.com/support/towing-calculator

 

[Nasto]

one thousand pounds of payload will evaporate like a grape sitting the hot sun
water, propane etc
so the truck will become the CARRIER of all the stuff


so good that your planning and lookign forward
nothing sucks more than being overweight

That's what I keep telling the wife.

 

[Nasto]

A couple of observations. First, TW of 500 does seem a little light, however the pictures of the airstream in this thread (forgive me if its not yours or the same one) don't show that there is a pass through storage up front. In fact, where ever the storage may be should be considered, because if its all in the back or middle over the axles, and there is nothing up front, maybe that TW is more correct than one thinks.

Second, I disagree with the notion that you will amass so much stuff that your weights will be egregiously different from a stock weight. Sure they will be different and it is to be noted. I have most of my storage in the front passthrough which is huge on my trailer and under the bed in the front. Is it heavier than the day I got it? Sure. maybe 300 lbs on the tongue if that, even if I have clothes in the bedroom. Is that alot? I guess, but I haven't added 1000's of pounds of stuff to the trailer since I got it. I mean are people putting full size home sofas in there? Motorcycles strapped to front? I just don't understand why everyone's "stuff" weighs so much.

Last, truck payload does some a little light. TLDR, but is that 1288 number based on payload minus people and "stuff" in the truck or is that on the sticker in the door jamb?

To go along with what I have already said, airstreams seem to be made a little different. No slides? Not a ton of storage for "stuff"? I feel like with what I would put in one, that it wouldn't change things all that much. But also means I'm using the truck more, and thats where payload comes into play.

For my trailer, I take my wife and I in the truck, maybe some snacks. My "sewer box" goes in the bed and thats it. So besides us, I maybe have another 50 lbs in the truck. Everything else is in the trailer. But I have a big pass through, and plenty of other storage area through out. Trailer is roughly 7k, with about 900 TW. Pulls great, I have not pulled super high long grades (that I know of). Last trip was michigan to custer sd, 7th gear the whole way, trans and engine temp never moved off the center point the entire way. Granted thats flat for 95% of the way, I doubt coming down from rapid city through hill city to custer and vice versa offered any severe grade. Truck never had any issue.

I'm not clear if the Max Payload includes the Added Weight section of the calculator, but the same 1288 number is also on my sticker.

This is the Airstream we had in mind, with all the options checked.

Summary - Airstream

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