How common are 14th Gen turbo failures?

[Dadofjax]

I took my Tremor 3.5 EB into service for first break in oil change last week (3.2K miles - 1.3K towing). I use the truck for 50-60% total mileage towing a 7K lb trailer. I asked to the tech to be very honest with me about wear and tear issues.
#1. Service the tranny at 30K, as well as diffs and TC. The tranny is the weak link. At any hint of shifting issues bring it in.
#2. ALWAYS let the engine idle 5-10 minutes to let turbos cool after towing. They have seen warped manifolds and flanges from not letting them cool.

I never stress anything with pedal to the metal hard accelerations. On acceleration, I let the turbos spool and tranny shift accordingly.

After a lifetime of doing 95% of my own maintenance and repairs I have decided to let the dealer do everything on this truck in case there is a warranty issue. My other trucks were Dodge 12 valve Cummins diesels. I am driving the Tremor like I drove my diesels. Which includes managing acceleration for turbo spool and letting them cool down after towing.

Hope this helps.

You rely on the dealership who can't diagnose an issue unless the computer tells them exactly what bolt to turn and which direction? Dealership are worthless and probably just scamming you out of maintenance you don't need cause again they are worthless and clueless.

Owner of new truck have to spend 10, 15, 20 HOURS of their own time and $100s of dollars on parts and subscriptions due to Ford dealership and IT incompetence and that is just one issue.

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[amschind]

The idle procedure, while completely appropriate for older oil cooled turbos, is inapplicable to these turbos for 2 reasons:
1) They're water AND oil cooled.
2) The PB WILL shut off the engine at whatever speed it wants. My take is that Ford is counting on #1. If Ford were wrong about that, basically every '21 PB would've had dead turbos by now, and we wouldn't be able to help that by idling the engine when shutting it off.

 

[rpold150]

Coming from my '87 Buick w/ an oil cooled turbo, idling (and a turbo timer) was a common practice after a hard run. Obviously if you're coming into the neighborhood at low speeds, that contributes to the cooling off process. I didn't read Diambo's post as suggesting a 5 minute idle every time you go to the grocery store. He's saying that if you've been in the boost getting the turbo extremely hot, it's a good idea to let it cool off by driving easy for a few minutes, or idling for a few minutes, instead of immediately turning the engine off.

 

[minirx7]

I took my Tremor 3.5 EB into service for first break in oil change last week (3.2K miles - 1.3K towing). I use the truck for 50-60% total mileage towing a 7K lb trailer. I asked to the tech to be very honest with me about wear and tear issues.
#1. Service the tranny at 30K, as well as diffs and TC. The tranny is the weak link. At any hint of shifting issues bring it in.
#2. ALWAYS let the engine idle 5-10 minutes to let turbos cool after towing. They have seen warped manifolds and flanges from not letting them cool.

I never stress anything with pedal to the metal hard accelerations. On acceleration, I let the turbos spool and tranny shift accordingly.

After a lifetime of doing 95% of my own maintenance and repairs I have decided to let the dealer do everything on this truck in case there is a warranty issue. My other trucks were Dodge 12 valve Cummins diesels. I am driving the Tremor like I drove my diesels. Which includes managing acceleration for turbo spool and letting them cool down after towing.

Hope this helps.

My truck has similar use towing 7K trailer. DRove about 46,000kms and 50% is towing. I am less concerned about the turbos and more concerned about this 10 speed. It is getting clunkier and the dealer said its normal.

Like you i never really get deep in the throttle while towing, and constanly watch boost to make sure i am not in boost. Easy and steady 70mph

 

[Karytas80]

My 2023 XLT PB was delivered with a bad turbo from the factory. When I picked up the truck 1100 miles away from home, I noticed a louder idle sound compare to other PBs in the lot. I drove another PB in the lot to compare and my truck drove just fine other than some kind of a flapping sound coming from under the hood with no CEL or any error messages. It drove just fine over 1100 miles back home and three weeks later, about 1hr after I dropped it off at a local dealer, my service advisor told me I had a bad turbo. My service advisor initially told me my truck sounds fine and it was a hybrid system making that loud sounds until one of technicians came out and told him that it didn't sound normal.

 

[Scotty_B]

You rely on the dealership who can't diagnose an issue unless the computer tells them exactly what bolt to turn and which direction? Dealership are worthless and probably just scamming you out of maintenance you don't need cause again they are worthless and clueless.

Owner of new truck have to spend 10, 15, 20 HOURS of their own time and $100s of dollars on parts and subscriptions due to Ford dealership and IT incompetence and that is just one issue.

I think it depends on the dealership and service tech. However, I agee incompetence seems to be more common these days. Nothing sold to me that I have not researched. However, increasing frequency of service intervals makes sense due to they way I use the truck.

All of my towing & 4wheeling above 6,000 feet and usually above 10,000 feet. So, letting turbos cool before shutdown is a no brainer.

It was a difficult decision to give up my 400K mile trusty Cummins for a 3.5 PB, knowing that 25+ years of technology changes have made things more complicated and difficult to maintain. However, I am old and broken up, so working on things myself has limitations.

 

[Calson]

It is a mistake to think that more frequent oil changes is good for the engine. The oil filter is least effective when it is new and before loading of the filter media has taken place. Same applies to the air filter in the truck.

Gas engines do not put anywhere near the stress on motor oil that a diesel engine provides and so I go by the engine computer which is going to calculate the time to change the oil based on how the vehicle has been driven. In my case roughly 70% of my miles driven are at freeway speeds and I do little or no stop and go driving, or driving with a cold engine as I avoid short trips whenever possible.

 

[diambo4life]

Coming from my '87 Buick w/ an oil cooled turbo, idling (and a turbo timer) was a common practice after a hard run. Obviously if you're coming into the neighborhood at low speeds, that contributes to the cooling off process. I didn't read Diambo's post as suggesting a 5 minute idle every time you go to the grocery store. He's saying that if you've been in the boost getting the turbo extremely hot, it's a good idea to let it cool off by driving easy for a few minutes, or idling for a few minutes, instead of immediately turning the engine off.

Exactly!

 

[diambo4life]

Turbos like good clean oil - I change my oil on a severe service schedule. Have changed it 6 times in 12K miles now, wanted to make sure with break in etc. I have replaced the gear oil in the in the front and rear diffs + new rear diff cover. Edit: I did the transmission too at ford dealer - all new ATF was $10+ a quart for the new stuff

That's how you do it!

 

[780]

Last time I had a turbo fail it was in a '80 Trans Am....

Shoulda listened to The Bandit and went with the 6.6L.

 

[amschind]

Coming from my '87 Buick w/ an oil cooled turbo, idling (and a turbo timer) was a common practice after a hard run. Obviously if you're coming into the neighborhood at low speeds, that contributes to the cooling off process. I didn't read Diambo's post as suggesting a 5 minute idle every time you go to the grocery store. He's saying that if you've been in the boost getting the turbo extremely hot, it's a good idea to let it cool off by driving easy for a few minutes, or idling for a few minutes, instead of immediately turning the engine off.

I get that, and I completely agree for an old pure oil-cooled turbocharged vehicle. My contention is that these trucks are 1) a completely different case because of the water cooling and 2) that your actions as a driver when you shut the truck down are irrelevant because you cannot prevent* the truck from running wide open at 17 PSI boost and shutting its own engine off 30 seconds later. I'm not always in the camp of "if Ford engineers say it's right well then by God it must be right!", but if they were wrong here we would know about it. I would know about it: my turbos would be dead if shutting the engine off shortly after running high-load/high-boost killed the bearings because the truck does that to itself all the time (i.e. WG closes driving at highway speed into a small town in West Texas, start slowing down and the ICE kicks off and truck goes into electric mode). I have actually resisted putting turbo blankets on it yet because I'm worried that heat soak into the engine bay was part of the calculation for the turbo housings cooling themselves under those conditions, and nobody really knows.

*if you only ever run the truck in Sport or Towing mode, you can keep the ICE on at all times. It might be hard to test if that improves or harms engine reliability and longevity because keeping the ICE on at all times isn't the only change that those modes make, so it's not a ceteris paribus test.

 

[hotrodmex]

I haven't noticed it being mentioned, but the EcoBoost was designed to have passive cooling on shut down. So, just shutting it of doesn't mean it will heat soak.

The EcoBoost engine uses passive thermal siphoning for water cooling,” Plagens explains. “During normal engine operation, the engine’s water pump cycles coolant through the center bearing. After engine shutdown renders the water pump inactive, the coolant flow reverses. Coolant heats up and flows away from the turbocharger water jacket, pulling fresh, cool coolant in behind. This highly effective coolant process is completely silent to the driver, continuing to protect the turbocharger.”

this is quoted from an article about the original ecoboost, but I wouldn't see why they would change it.

To validate their water-cooled turbo design choice, Ford engineers put EcoBoost through a special turbocharger test.

The test ran EcoBoost at maximum boost flat out for a 10-minute period. Then the engine and all cooling were abruptly shut down and the turbo was left to “bake” after this high-speed operation. If that sounds severe, imagine repeating this cycle 1,500 times without an oil change. That’s what EcoBoost’s turbos endured.

After 1,500 cycles, the turbos were cut open for detailed technical examination. The turbos passed the severe test with flying colors.

“We’ve attained things here the customer would never be able to do in their vehicle,” Plagens said. “Ten minutes of peak power (355 hp, 350 foot-pounds of torque) is something that’s probably only achievable in a vehicle for fractions of a minute, 10 seconds maybe in the extreme. We run it for 10 minutes many, many times over, and that’s far, far more harsh and severe than a vehicle test would be.”

 

[rpold150]

I get that, and I completely agree for an old pure oil-cooled turbocharged vehicle. My contention is that these trucks are 1) a completely different case because of the water cooling and 2) that your actions as a driver when you shut the truck down are irrelevant because you cannot prevent* the truck from running wide open at 17 PSI boost and shutting its own engine off 30 seconds later.

I agree. I was speaking of non hybrid, so your PB definitely creates a different situation.

 

[Gros Ventre]

Keep in mind that part of the issue of turbo spin down is whether there is oil flowing thru the bearing. Even if there is sufficient cooling if the oil flow stops then you risk metal to metal contact within the bearing. If you come off of an extended high power hill climb, maybe towing a load, to a sudden low power, engine off situation, the turbo can still be spinning. These things can get up to 100,000 rpm and take awhile to come to a stop. For example there is a 7 mile long continuous steep climb on I-64 in Virginia/West Virginia and when you get to the top it levels right off. Out here in Wyoming there are several climbs that are similar, South Pass for example. So paying attention to this can extend the life of the turbo. These turbo's should last a really long time if cared for. I'm sure Ford has considered this, that extra effort to provide cooling is an indicator. But in the end, a careful owner/driver can make a real difference.

 

[Rambo Crane]

Further updates;

Ford dealership confirmed drivers side turbo failure. Unsure on passenger side.

Replacement turbos ordered under warranty. Now the wait begins for parts.

@Ford Motor Company has been good about updating me weekly with updates.

It's unfortunate a $75k truck has failures this early on in ownership. I'm concerned about long term reliability. Additionally, the QA/QC on the 14th gen is not up to par w/ previous generations. I've owned a 2011, 2014, 2016 (F-250 6.7), 2019, and now 2022. The 2022 is the highest trim model owned and lowest quality of all previously owned trucks.

Stand by for additional updates.

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